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President Barron's full email response

  • Corey Dowlar said...

    I want to assure you that any decision made about FSU athletics will be reasoned and thoughtful and based on athletics, finances and academics. Allow me to provide you with some of the issues we are facing:

    In support of a move are four basic factors argued by many alumni:

    1. The ACC is more basketball than it is football, and many of our alumni view us as more football oriented than the ACC 2. The ACC is too North Carolina centric and the contract advantages basketball and hence advantages the North Carolina schools 3. The Big 12 has some big football schools that match up with FSU 4. The Big 12 contract (which actually isn't signed yet) is rumored to be $2.9M more per year than the ACC contract. We need this money to be competitive.

    But, in contrast:

    1. The information presented about the ACC contract that initiated the blogosphere discussion was not correct. The ACC is an equal share conference and this applies to football and to basketball ­ there is no preferential treatment of any university with the exception of 3rd tier rights for women's basketball and Olympic sports. FSU is advantaged by that aspect of the contract over the majority of other ACC schools. 2. Colorado, Missouri, Nebraska and Texas A&M left the Big 12, at least in part because the Big 12 is not an equal share conference. Texas has considerably more resource avenues and gains a larger share (and I say this as a former dean of the University of Texas at Austin - I watched the Big 12 disintegration with interest). So, when fans realize that Texas would get more dollars than FSU, always having a competitive advantage, it would be interesting to see the fan reaction. 3. Much is being made of the extra $2.9M that the Big 12 contract (which hasn't been inked yet) gets over the ACC contract. Given that the Texas schools are expected to play each other (the Big 12 is at least as Texas centered than the ACC is North Carolina centered), the most likely scenario has FSU playing Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State, and West Virginia on a recurring basis and the other teams sporadically (and one more unnamed team has to join to allow the Big 12 to regain a championship game), we realize that our sports teams can no longer travel by bus to most games ­ the estimate is that the travel by plane required by FSU to be in the Big 12 appears to exceed the $2.9M difference in the contract ­ actually giving us fewer dollars than we have now to be competitive with the Big 12 teams, who obviously do not have to travel as far. Any renegotiated amount depends not just on FSU but the caliber of any other new team to the Big 12. 4. Few believe that the above teams will fill our stadium with fans of these teams and so our lack of sales and ticket revenue would continue. 5. We would lose the rivalry with University of Miami that does fill our stadium 6. It will cost between $20M and $25M to leave the ACC ­ we have no idea where that money would come from. It would have to come from the Boosters which currently are unable to support our current University athletic budget, hence the 2% cut in that budget. 7. The faculty are adamantly opposed to joining a league that is academically weaker ­ and in fact, many of them resent the fact that a 2% ($2.4M) deficit in the athletics budget receives so much attention from concerned Seminoles, but the loss of 25% of the academic budget (105M) gets none when it is the most critical concern of this University in terms of its successful future.

    I present these issues to you so that you realize that this is not so simple (not to mention that negotiations aren't even taking place). One of the few wise comments made in the blogosphere is that no one negotiates their future in the media. We can't afford to have conference affiliation be governed by emotion ­ it has to be based on a careful assessment of athletics, finances and academics. I assure you that every aspect of conference affiliation will be looked at by this institution, but it must be a reasoned decision.

    Eric Barron President

    If this is a real letter from Barron, it is an unprofessional and one sided disgrace. I hate to confuse this nonsense with reality but

    1. So what? You gave up your third tier rights for much less money than the Big 12 in an ACC contract that does not get to $17 million until 2021.

    2. So what? If FSU stays in the ACC, EVERY TEAM IN THE SEC may be getting $10 million+ more than FSU. UT's only advantage is outside Tier 1 & 2 rights and are only an advantage because of the value of the UT franchise. UT's football team is 13-12 over the last two seasons and they only have two conference football championships in the 14 years since Brown arrived so they clearly do not know how to translate $ into championships. Nebraska and A&M were the big advocates for unequal revenue sharing on Tiers 1 & 2 which has disappeared since they left.

    3. $2.9 million? Barron conveniently ignores the severe escalation curve and the much longer term of the ACC deal as well as the targets that have to be met to trigger the $17 million. He also leaves out the step up Big 12 teams would receive from adding FSU and other teams, the championship game add on and the reality that attendance would very likely escalate with higher football quality Big 12 teams despite his notions to the contrary.

    At a minimum, FSU would be playing UT or OU every year and it would make huge sense for FSU to be in a division with one of them and playing the other as a designated rival each year. Even if the division Barron suggests was real, FSU should have a cake walk to the final 4. He conveniently leaves out the likely reality that 1 to 3 other ACC teams would likely be following FSU to the Big 12.

    The travel nonsense is a total canard. FSU would have no problem negotiating a subsidy for the difference between their ACC travel and Big 12 travel. The Big 12 teams would also be traveling to play WVU, FSU and any other ACC members who join.

    4. Yeah, right. The attendance would be the same with real quality football teams instead of basketball schools with football teams.

    5. There is no reason to give up the UM rivalry to play Murray St. and Savannah St.

    6. The exit fee is negotiable with both the ACC and the Big 12 and the long term benefits would far outweigh the cost. TCU and WVU figured that one out even with the existing Big 12 contract that is significantly less than the new one.

    7. How is the faculty in any way adversely affected by FSU moving to the Big 12? They might realize a huge benefit from the extra direct or indirect revenue the Big 12 would bring. How does staying in the ACC solve any of FSU budget issues?

    Yes it should be a reasoned decision but it is clear that Barron is inventing canards to justify maintaining the FALSE ILLUSION of higher academic standing for FSU in the ACC.

    As an FSU alum, I hope Haggard and the BOT have the stones to ignore Barron if this kindergarten thinking is real.

    This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by InsightTexas on 5/14/2012 at 3:59 PM

    InsightTexas

  • Our BOT will have the final say.

    Go Noles!!!

    seminole4life ●

  • This post was edited by madibeth on 5/14/2012 at 3:55 PM

    madibeth ●

  • I think the e-mail could be interpreted as the first phase in negotiations with the Big 12. If you read it in a different light, it sets forth all the concerns that the Big XII would need to address in order to attract FSU. It also allows Barron and FSU to make the Big 12 aware of those concerns without having to talk to them directly, thus enabling FSU to keep denying that it is "talking" with the Big XII.

    NoleReb

  • NoleReb said...

    I think the e-mail could be interpreted as the first phase in negotiations with the Big 12. If you read it in a different light, it sets forth all the concerns that the Big XII would need to address in order to attract FSU. It also allows Barron and FSU to make the Big 12 aware of those concerns without having to talk to them directly, thus enabling FSU to keep denying that it is "talking" with the Big XII.

    The problem is that it is so unprofessional in its assertions that no Big 12 professional could take it seriously and it does not reflect well on FSU.

    InsightTexas

  • InsightTexas said...

    If this is a real letter from Barron, it is an unprofessional and one sided disgrace. I hate to confuse this nonsense with reality but

    1. So what? You gave up your third tier rights for much less money than the Big 12 in an ACC contract that does not get to $17 million until 2021.

    2. So what? If FSU stays in the ACC, EVERY TEAM IN THE SEC may be getting $10 million+ more than FSU. UT's only advantage is outside Tier 1 & 2 rights and are only an advantage because of the value of the UT franchise. UT's football team is 13-12 over the last two seasons and they only have two conference football championships in the 14 years since Brown arrived so they clearly do not know how to translate $ into championships. Nebraska and A&M were the big advocates for unequal revenue sharing on Tiers 1 & 2 which has disappeared since they left.

    3. $2.9 million? Barron conveniently ignores the severe escalation curve and the much longer term of the ACC deal as well as the targets that have to be met to trigger the $17 million. He also leaves out the step up Big 12 teams would receive from adding FSU and other teams, the championship game add on and the reality that attendance would very likely escalate with higher football quality Big 12 teams despite his notions to the contrary.

    At a minimum, FSU would be playing UT or OU every year and it would make huge sense for FSU to be in a division with one of them and playing the other as a designated rival each year. Even if the division Barron suggests was real, FSU should have a cake walk to the final 4. He conveniently leaves out the likely reality that 1 to 3 other ACC teams would likely be following FSU to the Big 12.

    The travel nonsense is a total canard. FSU would have no problem negotiating a subsidy for the difference between their ACC travel and Big 12 travel. The Big 12 teams would also be traveling to play WVU, FSU and any other ACC members who join.

    4. Yeah, right. The attendance would be the same with real quality football teams instead of basketball schools with football teams.

    5. There is no reason to give up the UM rivalry to play Murray St. and Savannah St.

    6. The exit fee is negotiable with both the ACC and the Big 12 and the long term benefits would far outweigh the cost. TCU and WVU figured that one out.

    7. How is the faculty in any way adversely affected by FSU moving to the Big 12? They might realize a huge benefit from the extra direct or indirect revenue the Big 12 would bring. How does staying in the ACC solve any of FSU budget issues?

    Yes it should be a reasoned decision but it is clear that Barron is inventing canards to justify maintaining the FALSE ILLUSION of higher academic standing for FSU in the ACC.

    As an FSU grad, I hope Haggard has the stones to ignore Barron.

    Well stated.

    I too, am embarrassed by Barron's response.
    It is obviously missing in key factual information.

    I have no clue where he comes up with that 2.9 Mill figure.
    The Big 12 is rumored to be at about 20 mill BEFORE FSU and a Big 12 championship game.
    Since we add only `1 Mill this coming year that would put us around 14 mill.
    By my calculation that would be about 6 million difference BEFORE ANY FSU added value renegotiation with ESPN.

    Oh Well!

    I do acknowledge that much is not known at this stage.
    Facts are welcome!

    This post was edited by Tom81 on 5/14/2012 at 4:04 PM

    Tom81

  • NoleReb said...

    I think the e-mail could be interpreted as the first phase in negotiations with the Big 12. If you read it in a different light, it sets forth all the concerns that the Big XII would need to address in order to attract FSU. It also allows Barron and FSU to make the Big 12 aware of those concerns without having to talk to them directly, thus enabling FSU to keep denying that it is "talking" with the Big XII.

    Hopefully your right, however things won't really heat up until the Big 12 and BCS meetings in June.

    gonoles1

  • InsightTexas said...

    The problem is that it is so unprofessional in its assertions that no Big 12 professional could take it seriously and it does not reflect well on FSU.

    I can't really argue with that. I could have done without the unnecessary and rude comment about academics. But I wonder if that wasn't a bone he threw to the academics who are aggressively pushing him to shoot down a move to the Big XII.

    NoleReb

  • Tom81 said...

    I have no clue where he comes up with that 2.9 Mill figure. The Big 12 is rumored to be at about 20 mill BEFORE FSU and a Big 12 championship game. Since we add only `1 Mill this coming year that would put us around 14 mill. By my calculation that would be about 6 million difference BEFORE ANY FSU added value renegotiation with ESPN.

    The rumored $20/mil for the Big12 was also bantered about before the ACC renewed its contract...maybe the Big12 could get a little more based on what the ACC is getting paid to help increase its total payout and make it even more attractive to some of the ACC schools. Talk about irony.

    There is also an escalator clause in the Big12 contract for certain marque schools, with FSU likely one, it could add a lot more money to the contract, not to mention the CCG too. I do not think adding FSU will make the Big12 the best conference, but it would be within spitting distance of the SEC and getting the domers to eventually follow WOULD surpass the SEC.

    This post was edited by Scharnell on 5/14/2012 at 4:47 PM

    Scharnell

  • What schools are y'all thinking will follow FSU to the Big12?

    Chris_topher

  • Notre Dame will not join the BIG 12. They have embarassing academic statistics. Order of preference for ND would be ACC, BI0, Big East, Pac 12, Big 12, stay independent or SEC. Notre Dame actually cares about its sports other than football. They care more about their academics than any sport.

    I dont understand how you rate the BIG 12 so much better than the ACC in terms of competition. Va Tech, FSU, Miami, UNC, Clemson, Gerogia Tech vs. Texas, Oklahoma and OKST. Dont u dare say Baylor or KSU. They dont have staying power. Actually WVU is ok since they dont play anyone, but usually get smacked by the non conference opponents. The smart money would be for the ACC to create it's own network spanning the east coast. Air the games on there for revenue. ESPN gets first dibs,but the ACC network has to grow with New York and Pittsburgh markets.

    Envy the past, Fear the future

    Brannen55 ●

  • From my perspective, that email appears to have been written quickly. It has an awkwardness about it.

    This post was edited by Rice4Texas on 5/14/2012 at 5:15 PM

    Rice4Texas

  • Brannen55 said...

    Notre Dame will not join the BIG 12. They have embarassing academic statistics. Order of preference for ND would be ACC, BI0, Big East, Pac 12, Big 12, stay independent or SEC. Notre Dame actually cares about its sports other than football. They care more about their academics than any sport.

    I dont understand how you rate the BIG 12 so much better than the ACC in terms of competition. Va Tech, FSU, Miami, UNC, Clemson, Gerogia Tech vs. Texas, Oklahoma and OKST. Dont u dare say Baylor or KSU. They dont have staying power. Actually WVU is ok since they dont play anyone, but usually get smacked by the non conference opponents. The smart money would be for the ACC to create it's own network spanning the east coast. Air the games on there for revenue. ESPN gets first dibs,but the ACC network has to grow with New York and Pittsburgh markets.

    The faculty of Notre Dame wants the Big Ten or nothing. It has everything to do with CIC money.

    signature image

    12177 Post before moving here. 10/29/11 will live forever in our hearts (plus 50 votes in the last 3 hours)

    tJYD ●

  • Brannen55 said...

    Notre Dame will not join the BIG 12. They have embarassing academic statistics. Order of preference for ND would be ACC, BI0, Big East, Pac 12, Big 12, stay independent or SEC. Notre Dame actually cares about its sports other than football. They care more about their academics than any sport.

    I dont understand how you rate the BIG 12 so much better than the ACC in terms of competition. Va Tech, FSU, Miami, UNC, Clemson, Gerogia Tech vs. Texas, Oklahoma and OKST. Dont u dare say Baylor or KSU. They dont have staying power. Actually WVU is ok since they dont play anyone, but usually get smacked by the non conference opponents. The smart money would be for the ACC to create it's own network spanning the east coast. Air the games on there for revenue. ESPN gets first dibs,but the ACC network has to grow with New York and Pittsburgh markets.

    Laughable post.

    signature image signature image signature image

    Team Targaryen

    MarineMountie ●

  • MarineMountie said...

    Laughable post.

    And it was written by a 'Cane, let's point out.

    This post was edited by NoleReb on 5/14/2012 at 5:33 PM

    NoleReb

  • so Barron just got himself fired

    signature image signature image signature image

    FSU3456FSU ●

  • MarineMountie said...

    Laughable post.

    BOTTOM LINE: FSU believes the Big 12 will make their football team better. (Everything else in the discussion is bullcrap.) Personally, I don't think it's rocket surgery...
    How is FSU losing money and what is it being spent on?

    Chris_topher

  • 1st and 2nd Tier Rights are shared equally in the Big 12. Baylor gets as much as Texas.

    3rd Tier Rights are the property of the individual schools. Every one fends for themselves on this level.

    signature image
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    GetHooked

  • Barron is the furthest thing from a stupid man. It would be safe to assume he knows what he is doing.

    Jadaway ●

  • FSU3456 said...

    so Barron just got himself fired

    For trying to shut down any explorations after the BOT says its wants to explore? Or for releasing a letter to the public that has many factual inaccuracies and is not as tactful as it could be?

    This post has been edited 3 times, most recently by Rice4Texas on 5/14/2012 at 7:41 PM

    Rice4Texas

  • healthguyfsu said...

    According to their fans, excess travel costs will be absorbed by the conference not FSU. They could certainly be wrong but I also think Barron is not on the pulse with this.

    "According to their fans"?????? You'll believe some random internet post over your own University President? Half of those "fans" bought their allegiance to the longhorns when they bought the burnt orange t-shirt at Wal-Mart.fingergun

    The true test of a man's intelligence is how much he agrees with you.

    boone8466

  • Scharnell said...

    When Colorado and Nebraska left, that statement may have been partially true; when a&m and Missouri left, that statement is entirely false. The Big12 agreed to equal revenue sharing of all tier 1 and 2 rights (in an effort to keep Missouri from leaving), which are the only rights covered by the television contracts.

    The statements about Missou and TAMU are true only on the surface. By the time an offer of changing the way TV revenue was distributed came out, A&M was 100% out the door and Missou was 95% gone. It was more to keep any other schools from leaving (OU, Ok State, Texas Tech and ?? were looked at by the PAC 12), thus trying to save the BIG 12.

    The true test of a man's intelligence is how much he agrees with you.

    boone8466

  • boone8466 said...

    "According to their fans"?????? You'll believe some random internet post over your own University President? Half of those "fans" bought their allegiance to the longhorns when they bought the burnt orange t-shirt at Wal-Mart.fingergun

    Because there could never be anyone educated or informed on the internet.

    NOLES_WIN ●

  • This post is for members of Noles247 or All Access VIP members only. Start Free Trial

    natediggy247 ●

  • 6. It will cost between $20M and $25M to leave the ACC ­ we have no idea
    where that money would come from. It would have to come from the Boosters
    which currently are unable to support our current University athletic
    budget, hence the 2% cut in that budget

    This needs to change!

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    ZZ1059

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