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This isn't "We didn't start the fire"
In my opinion, 18-24 is developing at least 5-years slower than in the past, because a number of reason... the primary being...societies expectation of them has changed drastically...
Ask any long-term principal or teacher, of any school in this town... and I guarantee you, every single one of you will tell you, parenting is at an all-time low right now... and this isn't a random observation, it can be scientifically proven. It's not because the public school system is getting crappier teachers, it's because there is a much larger portion of students who have very little parental guidance.
Now whether some of the cause is females going to work (where as they used to stay home), single moms, technology, society lowering expectations of parents... etc. etc.. who knows the exact causal break down...
But I would not make the mistake of filing this under "this has always been this way, every generation thinks they had it harder"... there are some irrefutable statistics giving significant teeth to this claim, over the past 10-years .
Whether it's good or bad over the long run... I have no idea... I mean perhaps kids in the 50's and 60's were being forced to grow up too fast, which could cause problems also?
This post was edited by FsuFanForever 13 months ago
thanks 954....it was a last minute thing.
This is an interesting topic, why is a generation so "lazy". I think we can look at this on a micro level and maybe find out why it happens on a macro level.
They say the cycle of accumulating and losing wealth generally happens like this. It takes one generation to earn it, the second to grow it, and the third to lose it. Read and interpret that as you may, but that's the cycle I've read about many times.
So maybe the boomers parents built this nation. Their kids grew this nation. Now the boomers kids, who had a very nice ride as a kid with more cars, entertainment, access to almost everything, failed to learn the proper skills growing up to continue driving the car at the same speed. Just a thought.
"I never knew I had a foot until I noticed it was on your neck"
I'm actually really interesting in the research you mention. When you say "parenting is at an all time low," I also don't know what parenting you're talking about. Is it low-education single moms on some kind of government assistance versus yesteryear's heroic farming moms? Is it modern progressive parents who use timeouts as opposed to yesteryear's belt-wielding blue-collar dads?
It takes time to track down some research you saw in passing 2 years ago, so I don't blame you if you can't find it, but if you do know where to find it...
I ask because any time this subject comes up I always suspect it's the old defense of authoritarian, spanking parenting, the complaint that "kids these days are soft" because "everybody gets a trophy" and parents don't pull out the belt. I am not aware of any evidence that shows our society has suffered from a lack of authoritarian parenting, but if there is any...
I always come back to a conversation I had with somebody a few months ago. He criticized my gentle parenting and said, "See, my children never threw tantrums. They knew that was unacceptable, and they'd get whipped. You have to lay down the law and let them know where you stand and then they'll learn respect. You can't be your child's friend. Otherwise kids grow up to be whiny." You know the whole spiel.
Anyhow, not 60 seconds later the same guy was telling me that his 35-year-old daughter "Does nothing but complain about life. We don't talk anymore." And I was thinking wow, man, your parenting style sure did work great, just like you said.
Moved to OTR
This post has been edited 3 times, most recently by FsuFanForever 13 months ago
Forever: Thanks for a very clarifying and detailed answer. Much respect! I am interested in this subject and I hope someday I'll get a chance to research it. I'm a political scientist, not a sociologist or education researcher, but it's important to me.
This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by FsuFanForever 13 months ago
(Sorry for the thread hijack everybody...not much longer i promise)
I always thought most (maybe not elite) private schools paid less than public as public school teachers have unions that bargain for better contracts, plus publics have the resources that come from the taxation power if government. But I could well be mistaken!
My wife and I have been checking out kindergartens in Tsllahassee. I found the teachers at a public school (good neighborhood, one of the better reputations) appeared really good. They were confident veteran teachers and they were definitely teaching, not managing behavior. The classroom was a buzz of productive activity with happy kids--and diversity.
The private school we checked out had no diversity...and similarly happy kids. The teacher was good, but not quite the master teacher we saw at the public school.
We are leaning toward private because the public school has 7 K teachers--that's essentially 7 different schools, and you don't know that you'll get the awesome teacher you saw on the tour. The private teacher we saw and liked just fine...we know, not just hope, she'd be the one.
I'm under no illusions that a public school in an upper-middle-class neighborhood looks anything like a public school on the south side. Indeed, it was only distinguishable from private in the presence of kids of color--who were happily participating like everybody else.
Whatever you may think of his politics, it might be worth a google search to find Paul Begala's op-ed from a few years back called "The Worst Generation." It was about baby boomers. It is a fun read. The great movie Shampoo (starring Warren Beatty and directed by the great Hal Ashby), from 1975, has also been interpreted by many people as a withering commentary on baby boomers.
This post was edited by chrisdoc 13 months ago
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